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Discussion Starter #1
I'm doing a 4BT swap for a buddy of mine and I thought i'd just post what my build plans are to make it easier for the next guy and to get any advice anyone might have. I'm using the 4R70W tranny with a TCI master race clutch kit and controlling it with a US Shift Quick 4. I'm also installing a deep tranny pan and 1,600 to 1,800 rpm stall torque converter both from Monster Transmissions. I installed new power steering and transmission coolers on the front of the condenser and then mounted a Mishimoto intercooler, model MMINT-UZ, in their place. I'm planning on using a Destroked 12valve to 4R100 gas adapter plate to bolt the tranny to the engine, but it hasn't come yet to know for sure. My dad has a machine shop so I plan to have him make an A/C compressor bracket kind of like the Dodge 5.9 has. I also plant to have him make an adapter for my flex plate. The engine is freshly rebuilt and we'er using 5X .014 injectors and an HX35W turbo; the main short coming of the engine is that it has an A-pump. Any advice would be appreciated, especially on how to mod the A-pump.
 

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Sort of curious why the 4R70W. Even though you're having it beefed up, a 4R100 would be far superior. Those came behind diesels. You're stall speed might be a tad high for a Cummins. Peak torque hits right near 1800 RPM. Seem most of our guy with automatics try for around 1300-1400 RPM. A 5x.014 injector is gigantic. We've had several guys try them but they are too big. 5x.012 can probably do near 400 HP on a P pump engine. You won't like a HX35W on a 4bt. Just too big. Great turbo for a 6bt. Good primary for twins on a 4bt. It will be slow on boost until the very top end. A Super HX30W will run circles around it. Between those huge injectors and the big turbo you will expect some high EGT's and a lot of smoke. The A pump may not like those injectors. What pop pressure do they have? The A can be souped up to insane levels. A company called Fair Valley Performance can do that. Here's a link to their site. http://www.fvpdiesel.com/truck-and-tractor-pulling/pulling-injection-pumps/
 

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Okay maybe i should look into changing a few things. My buddy was first looking to get around 250 hp then he was like 50 more can't be that hard let's try for 300. The guy from where we bought the engine said these where the nozzles and turbo we'd need. I don't like alot of smoke and high EGT's are scarry. BTW what is the EGT "red line" for a 4BT? As for the 4R70, well it's what we had and it seemed cheaper to mod it and see how it held up.
 

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One of our members, Alcaid, can get it for you. They come out of China but it is a genuine Holset. Before you go with that one, need to narrow down your power level. An A pump probably won't do 300 HP in stock form. May not even get to 250 HP. Going to need some modification by a pump shop. 250 HP is near the limit for a single turbo on a 4bt. It would be much better to run twins at that level or higher. A 44mm HX30W paired with a HX35W or WH1C would be better matched to your power level and have very low EGT. Could even use a Super HX40W for the primary. Most guys set 1200 deg for the top EGT just to be safe. Running the twins set I mentioned you may not see 1000 deg. For the power levels you mentioned, you don't need over a 5x.012 injector. You need to be careful because an A pump uses a lower pop pressure injector like the VE pump. Not sure what spray angle your pistons are but a guess would be 145 deg which is the same as a P pump. The other thing you need to be aware of on your transmission is the Cummins delivers torque about 2.5 time the HP. So a true 300 HP will be spitting out about 750 lb ft of torque. That's enough to damage lots of parts and it comes on around 1800 RPM. Hope you have some HD axles in the plans because base F150 parts won't live long under that kind of torture.
 

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I've got an 03 F150 SuperCrew 2wd with 4bt. Nice ride. I still have the H1C turbo. I have an HY30W laying around that is brand new to put on it. Just haven't had enough time because of working on other "junk" to swap it over. Im running the 47RH and its a great transmission with the proper valve body upgrades. I've rebuilt a few of them and one 4R70W. I went the the ford trans about 4 times and had a local shop look at it (gas application) still couldn't get it to work right. Main thing is that the shafts inside it are MUCH smaller than the 47RH. I wouldn't even thing about the 4R70w. Tear one down and look at it. Not made for that kind of low end torque. Also, you can get a set of front springs for a 97 3/4 Ford that will fit in the f150 and compensate for the extra weight. I have two regrets with my F150. One is that i started driving it before i finished it so its still not complete. Two, i haven't put the Hy30 on it to wake it up. The denny T stage two pin made a lot of difference, but you've got to watch the EGT's closely.

PS you can look at my build to see what Intercooler will work the easiest. Its a BEHR i got out of a freight liner van. I used a double pass F150 radiator (4x4 probably already has it) and For taurus fans.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
One of our members, Alcaid, can get it for you. They come out of China but it is a genuine Holset.
I'm new to the forum. How do I get a hold of Alcaid? Does anyone have pics. of their compound setups? I would prefer to just back the power down and save the trans, but who knows what my buddy will want. What do you think I could get out of the single Super HX30 and 5X .012 injectors fed by an A-pump? 200?? Does any one know how to turn up the A-pump without actually installing any new parts, or wouldn't that gain me much?
 

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I'm new to the forum. How do I get a hold of Alcaid?
edit....
go to the top, pull down the tab that says "community" and pick in the tab "members list" and send him a PM.
 

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Discussion Starter #10 (Edited)
I talked to the guy that sold my buddy this engine. He said this turbo is (Area Diesel part # 70-4008) not a true HX35W, but has been modified for quicker spooling. Also according to him it is better to use bigger nozzles and keep the pump set back further. Any body that knows about the combo of these nozzles and the a-pump please give your opinion. Still open for suggestions.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
What do guys do for a tps. I thought i had it figured out, i was going to use a accelerator pedal position sensor from a vehicle with an electric throttle, but there's not enough resistance.
 

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What do guys do for a tps. I thought i had it figured out, i was going to use a accelerator pedal position sensor from a vehicle with an electric throttle, but there's not enough resistance.
My first thought, since you have a machine shop at your disposal, is to use the Ford TPS and build an adapter so its actuated by the throttle linkage. But, it may be counterproductive.
 

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Discussion Starter #14
Has anybody had any experience with a military engine? The name plate with the serial number has been removed and the guys at Fair Valley Diesel couldn't cross my injection pump numbers over to anything.
 

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design

Any ideas on a design?

Post up a pic of the pump and linkage. I've looked up a pic of the TPS from the stock FORD 4r70w. I guess that's still the plan? the intermediate shaft in that baby is SMALL. Im really afraid she won't live too long.
 

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Is the ID plate still on the injection pump? Often from that you can cross reference to the Cummins CPL. Engine ID plates are often missing. One thing. If Cummins ever rebuilt it they may have stamped the serial # on the back of the block just below the head. Worth a look see. A pumps were all industrial. I have an industrial parts manual that has 3 different A pumps It covers CPL 2109, 2302, and 2361. The first # is a 4BTA, the next a 4BT, and the last a 4B.
 

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Discussion Starter #17 (Edited)
Here are the numbers that are on the pump in the order that they appear. I discovered i had sent the guy at Fair Valley some wrong numbers, so we'll see what he says when i send him these. Here are also some pics of the pump.

86962275
F 002 AOZ 057
PES4A95D120RS2927
 

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You wouldn't use any electronic accelerator with that pump. It is totally mechanical. Your 2nd number beginning with the F is the OEM Bosch part #. The bottom number is the basic model. Tells you it's a 4 cylinder A pump with 9.5mm plungers and a few other things. Not sure about that first number in you list. Sort of expected that to be the Cummins part #.
 

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Discussion Starter #20
You wouldn't use any electronic accelerator with that pump. It is totally mechanical.
I thought i could use the accelerator position sensor as a tps and add mechanical linkage to the pedal to control the pump; but the sensor didn't have the right resistance.
 
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