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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hi everyone,

Wanna be heavy equipment mechanic here. I bought this gradall 534c-6 telehandler with a 3.9 cummins recently and it won't start. Prior this, I never worked on a diesel before.

History about this telehandler:

1-engine started before and ran no issues even after sitting for a while. It has 8k hrs and it sat most of the time before I bought it.
2-I checked all the lines for cracks and found none.
3-I replace the lift pump.
4-replaced fuel filters.
5-Bled fuel lines to the Injection pump and there is fuel going to the pump.
6-I checked the shutoff solonoid and it was stuck close. I really thought this was it and I removed the rubber stopper and reinstalled it until I get a replacement.
I cranked the engine and it seemed to start. Then I realized the key got stuck on -start- and it was actually the starter that was turning the engine (lol) so It burned out...
7-I removed the steel injector fuel lines and there is a bit of fuel coming out when cranking but not much pressure? is this normal? definitely not 2-3k psi squirting out.

Until my new starter comes in and I can troubleshoot more, how do I rule out a bad injection pump? I removed the pick up tube in the tank and I didn't see any cracks on it. I guess my next thing to do will be to get a container with fuel and bypass the fuel tank to rule out any issues there.
 

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This shows what the IP out put should look like
 

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There will be no pressure with the lines off, the fuel will just flow out. Pressure will only occur when there is something to work against, in this case the spring pressure in the injectors. There will be a little pressure when the lines are on the pump but not hooked to the injectors and that will make it spurt a little.
My guess is you just have air in the system from sitting and it needs a good bleed.
 

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First off, does your machine's engine have the VE or P injection pump? From your description of the solenoid it's probably the VE. Does your injection pump have the mechanical lever to turn the pump on and off? Some pumps do not have that feature and only work with the solenoid. Below are photos of one with and without the manual control lever. Sometimes it takes a while to get the air out of the lines. The fact that the unit sat for a long period could be an issue. Old fuel can gum up the parts in the injection pump or injectors. A good fuel additive is also a recommendation to keep things clean. It would be wise to remove the injectors and have them pop tested. That isn't very expensive and may tell you if there is a need to rebuild or replace them. Does the engine have its ID plate. If so, post the serial number an I can look up parts should you need any. Sometimes on a first start up it may be needed to squirt a bit of starting fluid into the intake. No need to over do that. On the injection pump pressure, as was mentioned you need resistance to build pressure. If you crack the lines open when it is running that fuel sprays all over the place. Be careful as that pressure can shoot the stuff through you skin. Keep your body parts clear and wear eye protection.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
I appreciate the reply -Chart-!. Pump is neither. Below is a picture of what the pump looks like. Starting fluid worked few 2 times I started it a few weeks ago but then it wouldn't work. Turns over for a a few secs then shuts off.
 

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Been awhile since I have seen one of these but believe it is the shutoff lever.
Do you have a pic of your actual pump? Showing the levers and fuel solenoid?
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
I'll take a few pics tomorrow. I haven't had time to work on it. I got the new starter and it still wouldn't start. I will bypass the fuel tank this next time and put clear hose lines to see if there is air anywhere.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
So I got the new shutoff solonoid in and replaced it hoping it would fix the issue but it still won't start. I took the plunger off the old solonoid and reinstalled it initially you can see in the picture and I was hoping somehow that metal tip was blocking the fuel from going thru but I guess it didn't make a difference. The new solonoid works great, the old one was stuck closed and it wouldn't retract. I also removed the pickup tube you can see in the pictures and there are not leaks in it. I plugged the end off with my finger and blew into it and there are no air leaks. Same with the fuel lines going into the lift pump. I bled the lines all the way to the pump and there is fuel coming out of the injector lines. When I crank it, I noticed there is no smoke coming out of the exhaust. Not sure what to do at this point besides bleeding the injector lines some more... Any suggestions?
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
So today i had some help with someone cranking it while I took a look at the injector lines. They're barely putting out any fuel. New solonoid is working and getting 12.5v and bled the lines to the injector pump. I think my pump maybe clogged what do you guys think?
 

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Yes, it sounds like you have pump issues. I watched a video where a guy had a Perkins with a similar style injection pump and he was having the same issues. Pump needed a rebuild and that cleared up the problem. If that is the issue be prepared for a bit of cost. Pump rebuilds are never cheap. He videoed the process while the company rebuilt it . You quickly see why those rebuilds are expensive. Those techs don't work for $10/hr. This guy rarely referenced any books. The knowledge was in his head. Here's that video if you want to watch it.
The rebuild starts at about 8 minutes in the video. Another thing to do is remove the injectors and have them pop tested. Poorly operating injectors make for a poor running engine. Testing them is not an expensive thing. Rebuilt units vary in cost. I notice this is a 4B engine. Is the ID plate on the side of the front gear cover? If so, what is your serial number? I can look up parts if necessary.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
thanks for the video, I like watching wes along with diesel creek and andrew camarata. Main reason why i just don't pay a mechanic to fix this for me lol. I will go ahead and order a pump and see how it goes. I'll make a video and post it on youtube as well. I'm sure I'm not the only one with this problem. I still don't get how unlucky I must be to have a bad pump. I mean these other guys are reviving machines that have been sitting for years and they fire right up...
 

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Yeah, I've watched those videos too. Lots of those are Cat engines or Detroit. Those old Cats were near indestructible. They had their own injection pump. The Detroit is a totally different animal and I've seen them come to life after years of being idle. I watched one video on an old Cat front end loader that hadn't run in 20 years. It was sitting in a barn so it was in the dry. The guy checked all the fluids which were still OK, installed a new set of batteries, hit the starter switch and about one revolution it fired right up like it was run yesterday. Wasn't even any major smoke. Here's that video you might enjoy.
 

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crazy they didn't even put in fresh fuel, how is that even possible!
Diesel fuel ages differently than gasoline. Gasoline with ethanol added goes bad very quickly.
 
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