Respectfully, would it be a good idea to replace the valve springs or further upgrade them (beehives would be kinder to the valvetrain) due to the enormous strain you have put your existing ones through & will soon escalate abuse?

Ed

 

Respectfully, would it be a good idea to replace the valve springs or further upgrade them (beehives would be kinder to the valvetrain) due to the enormous strain you have put your existing ones through & will soon escalate abuse?

I was thinking the same thing your springs might bind a high RPMs, if your going this far might as well go all the way.

 

I'd like to see an estimate of the number of loonies this is going to entail. I see a constant parade of members who think they can do this without spending very much and it will last forever.

 

Price is Right rules.

My guess is 7 (loonies).

 

Also, I have decided to take my Dakota in a different direction. It is going to be a 100% play toy and a showpiece for my company. Now that doesn't mean I have an unlimited budget, but I'm not going to skimp on the engine. And I am fully aware that in my quest for 600rwhp I may break parts, or seriously hurt this engine. So be it, I will enjoy the challenge and the fun it brings me.

 

I'm curious... has anyone had a block or crank fail from just torque/rpm and not some other issue such as going lean or smaller part failure?

Ive heard (not seen) that there have been several 4bt motors pushed over the 700hp mark... curious to what was done internally to make them hold up.

Also... paritally filling the block... how will that effect cooling and what not?

-Chris

 

most crank failures I've seen have been from extreme torque output at low rpms. I'm building my engine into more of a high rpm screamer. Hoping to turn 5000rpm out of it consistently. You pretty much build it like you would a 6BT with 1/3 more power. I have seen many street trucks with half filled blocks, I wouldn't tow super heavy with it, but moderate loads yes. Fully filled blocks are another story, I wouldn't run a fully cemented block on a street truck. Unless you had rediculous amounts of oil cooling and bigger/more piston cooling jets.

 

Serious Coin.
I'm scrounging funds just to finish the Toyota at this point, after a relatively stock engine rebuild.
This stuff adds up fast.....
What do you think you have into the Dakota parts cost wise?
I haven't tallied reciepts from the last year or two, 25k came and went, I'd think I'm somewhere between 30 and 35k now....whole project...
Your dakota's gotta be in that realm no?

Nevermind the 10-15 grand i'll drop building new portal axles in a few years....



also what configuration steed speed header are you doing? center mount with flange on the angle?

 

What do you think you have into the Dakota parts cost wise?
I haven't tallied reciepts from the last year or two, 25k came and went, I'd think I'm somewhere between 30 and 35k now....whole project...
Your dakota's gotta be in that realm no?

also what configuration steed speed header are you doing? center mount with flange on the angle?

I was somewhere in the 30-35k range before I started thit motor build. I'm getting the stock 12V style steed speed manifold. So center mount with angled flange.

How much lift is your cam going to have.

Lots

hey khaos
your parts list looks very simliar to my build have you been sneaking around my workshop?
i have about $5500 out in parts at the moment still got about another 2-3000 to drop,
plus machine work, so i think at the ended of the day it will owe about 10,000 grand Aus
think we might be on the same track here i was going to do some major head work but after speaking with a few people i think that just a light port clean up and a good valve job will do.

Also have you done anything with the girdle yet?
im trying to get a cnc file from the guys over on comp D for a 6bt then run it through the autocad for the 4bt and
get one water cut. will let you know how i go with it.
Do you think that you will need to grout the block?

I was looking at all the different girdles available, and the only 1 worth even using is one from Kenny's Pulling Parts. It is 3/4 inch thick steel, is not bolted to the tops of the mains through goofy studs, you have to machine the caps to accept it, and is dowled to the main caps and the oil pan rail. All the other girdles can twist your mainline bore when they are torqued down, and everytime you torque it can twist it a different way. The KPP girdle would be used on a serious serious sledpulling engine. What do you mean by grout the block? Sorry, but I haven't heard that term before. If you mean filling the cooling jackets with a cement, then yes, I will be doing that. Cementing the bottom half and running really really good main studs, not ARP's, will be more then enough strength for my block. As for cyl head, if you have it in your budget to cut the intake off, port and polish everthing and build your own intake, then do it. It is worth every penny. This time around it is not in my budget for me to do anything with the cyl head. But the way I see it, the cyl head is easy enough to take off in the truck, so I can get it done anytime. Whereas a cam swap, or anything else to do with the block is not so easy to service in frame.

I'm also curious about something...

Does the 4bt still get decent fuel mileage turned up when driving it normally? Basically... if you arnt using the power... are you still dumping fuel or can you still get good fuel mileage?

I'm getting ready to drop a 120hp ve aftercooled motor in my tahoe... leaving it stock until I can get a different trans.. (4l60e currently... will be 4l80e or allison eventually)

Mileage is a big concern of mine on this build

-Chris

The 4BT gets decent mileage when turned up to the 200hp range. I don't know what mine is goind to do, but it will be doing more 1/4 mile passes then street miles next year.

 

we need government funding.bounce

 

How much lift is your cam going to have.

 

hey khaos
your parts list looks very simliar to my build have you been sneaking around my workshop?
i have about $5500 out in parts at the moment still got about another 2-3000 to drop,
plus machine work, so i think at the ended of the day it will owe about 10,000 grand Aus
think we might be on the same track here i was going to do some major head work but after speaking with a few people i think that just a light port clean up and a good valve job will do.

Also have you done anything with the girdle yet?
im trying to get a cnc file from the guys over on comp D for a 6bt then run it through the autocad for the 4bt and
get one water cut. will let you know how i go with it.
Do you think that you will need to grout the block?

 

I'm also curious about something...

Does the 4bt still get decent fuel mileage turned up when driving it normally? Basically... if you arnt using the power... are you still dumping fuel or can you still get good fuel mileage?

I'm getting ready to drop a 120hp ve aftercooled motor in my tahoe... leaving it stock until I can get a different trans.. (4l60e currently... will be 4l80e or allison eventually)

Mileage is a big concern of mine on this build

O... and for some insperation...http://www.dieselpowermag.com/features/0909dp_south_bend_clutch_mud_rail/index.html

Nothing like 700whp and 1600+lb. ft from a 4bt... Apparently, after doing some research last night, there are a few guys in the 1kwhp range with these motors...
-Chris

 

How turned up are you talking about? I'm getting 22/24 with my 6000# truck and I drive it pretty hard.
Dave

 

Sounds good... cant wait to see some progress shots of the new build

I do have one more question while I'm on the subject... I know a lot of guys run the 3200gov spring... I also know that much more requires valve springs... I'm curious as to what the bottom end can handle safely with 60# springs and perhaps a 6bt harmonic balancer...? Reason I ask is because I would like to have a little room... I dont want the truck shifting as soon as I lay into the throttle from a stop... and since the trans is geared for a gasser, I'm sure it will even with a 3200 spring

Would the motor your are putting together hold the 5k+rpm you'll be turning for sustained periods?

Basically, I'm new to diesel performance... Ive built many gassers but never a diesel... this 4bt project will be my first.

Thanks for the input and sorry for getting somewhat off topic.
-Chris

 

The motor I'm putting together should be able to handle 5000rpm continuously. I ran my old motor up to 3600rpm with the 3200 gov spring and 60lb springs.

 

Since you got the 14mm mains, I would just buy Haisley or A1 main studs for it. Don't even worry about the girdle. The marine caps are wider. I'll see if I can find a part #. Stock rods are good for 800hp in a 6bt, just polish and destress them. Make sure you use good bolts again, no ARP's.

 

Already got all my bolts and studs from haisley all a1 stuff they are really nice,
When I get back home I will post a pic of all the parts so far the rest are in a container with a 2006 ram
Should be leaving the states in the next few days I hope

 

Hey Khaos,
Check this link there is a lot of good information from Gale Banks,
http://books.google.com.au/books?id...sult&ct=result&resnum=1&ved=0CCUQ6AEwAA#v=onepage&q=banks diesel plenum&f=false
Cheers Stuart

 

so here's a big question...how much power can u expect? 600-700??

 

I don't know. I want to run 11.90's in the 1/4 mile. So hopefully I got more then enough power to hit that time so I can dial it back and be able to adjust for changing track conditions.

 

Hey Khaos
I have just got a 6bt main girdle cutting/dfx file so in the next few week i will re work it to suit the 4bt,
Let me know if you interested in a copy. just in case you decide you want to get one water cut and machined to suit your requirments.
Stuart

 

I'd be ineterested to see a pic or drawing of the girdle your building.

 

Here's a pic of my new steed speed manifold

 

that thing is sexy!
$620 for a manifold is spendy. It might be just me, but that manifold looks like it sticks out a little farther thatn a chopped 6bt manifold. Let me know if the exhaust bolts back into place without any issues. Might need to eventually get one for my truck!

 

It is the competition version, so it does stick out an extra 3/4 of an inch. I can rotate easily pivot my bottom turbo, so I shouldn't have any issure getting the exhaust back on.

 

Got some more parts in. Just need to finish loading the pics. Got my Billet front timing cover and adjustable pump gear. Also got the block half filled with hardblock. Pistons should be out of the coaters next week, cam should aslo be here next week. Then I have to get the crank, rods, pistons, damper and flexplate sent to the machine shop for balancing.

 

Also got the block half filled with hardblock.

I find this intresting. ive heard of fully concreting block water passages, but never half full. If it's half full, how did u do that? did u fill around the cylinders and in structurally weaker spots or just a bit everwhere?

 

When I've seen that done it was filled to just below the water pump port (pour until you get there, then stop) block must be upright and level to do this.