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Isuzu reliability tester
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Discussion Starter #761
Yeah it should make for a bit of fun. The full size truck guys seem to love it I just hope it's up to the task of some diesel torque.
 

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Yeah, high impulse low fequency (ie 4cyl) diesel.

The fellah I know with the C3 says it was a 1 year deal, lost their shirt since the didn't sell.

Aparently somewhat upscale AWD pickup.

I think it'd look kinda neat with the C3 badge next to the "FORD" on your tailgate.

Tell 'em it's an old Ford Powertrain Development Vehicle.:D

I'll email the guy and see what year his truck is.
 

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It appears to be the same transfercase. Check my link a few posts above and compare it to the pictures in that article.

I had the pleasure of participating in some organised snow driving in brand new audi quattros just last year. Slalom, understeer & oversteer drills etc. If you can pull it off this truck will be just as much fun but in the dry and grippy.
 

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If you want to use the 5R110 maybe a Expedition t-case will bolt up? They have an AWD mode.
 

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Isuzu reliability tester
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Discussion Starter #766
I was reading up on the c3 on another site for LSX powered trucks is very similar to the SS silverados and siera denali's and uses the nv149. The c3 was only made for 2001 model year for some reason.

The other thing I didnt think about was the 4x4 front diff having the actuator and trucks like the SS being factory AWD have a permanently fixed front diff. I wonder whats a good way to fix this?

I have a few options I guess I can put a locker in there, how do you guys think that would work on a street truck? should be just fine and still smooth thanks to the AWD Tcase right? I could also wire up a switch in the cab to deactivate the AWD when I dont want it like when I go to dyno? I wonder how long the front diff activator would last if I keep it engaged 99% of the time the truck is running? I would imagine it would last a very long time. Thoughts anyone?
 

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I was reading up on the c3 on another site for LSX powered trucks is very similar to the SS silverados and siera denali's and uses the nv149. The c3 was only made for 2001 model year for some reason.

The other thing I didnt think about was the 4x4 front diff having the actuator and trucks like the SS being factory AWD have a permanently fixed front diff. I wonder whats a good way to fix this?

I have a few options I guess I can put a locker in there, how do you guys think that would work on a street truck? should be just fine and still smooth thanks to the AWD Tcase right? I could also wire up a switch in the cab to deactivate the AWD when I dont want it like when I go to dyno? I wonder how long the front diff activator would last if I keep it engaged 99% of the time the truck is running? I would imagine it would last a very long time. Thoughts anyone?
I'm not sure what you mean by the actuator/activator for front diff, or permanently fixed front diff.

I regularly use rear and front lockers off road. I wouldn't ever want a front locker engaged on road - steering would be dangerous IMHO.

My knowledge of AWD/full time 4WD vehicles is mostly limited to Land Rovers and Landcruisers, but I doubt any would allow this to be switched off for running on a 2wd dyno. They usually have a centre diff or viscous coupling for on road use - centre diffs need to be locked for off road use. To run on a 2wd dyno, jack front wheels of floor or lock centre diff and remove front drive shaft.
 

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Isuzu reliability tester
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Discussion Starter #768
Sorry I should have explained, sometimes I type without thinking lol. The chassis I'm thinking of using (chevy 2500 4x4) uses an IFS front suspension with an actuator that is engaged when you engage the transfer case into 4wd. I may be wrong on this but from what I understand the the actuator locks the front driveshaft to the front diff so it can turn the front wheels.

Here is a quote from another website "The disconnect allows the front left and right wheels to spin independently of each other, and allows the front prop-shaft to remain still while in 2WD mode. This helps to prevent the front differential and prop-shaft seals from wearing, and theoretically reduces the rolling resistance of the drive train to improve the fuel mileage."

I guess I need to research how the AWD and the 4WD front diffs are different (besides the awd unit not having an actuator) and decide which one I will want to go with.

You do bring up a good point John. I guess I could always go with an E locker like I am going to install in the rear axle so I can have a normally open diff then flip a switch and have it fully locked for when I plan on going fast in a straight line :D
 

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The front differential shouldn't be any different inside. Sounds like what they are talking about is the long side axle shaft being in 2 pieces and having a locking ring that connects the two when 4wd is engaged. This has no effect on the actual differential. I have seen people permanently lock them to get rid of the weak link of the actuator which affectivly just turns a 2 piece axle shaft into one single always locked shaft. Take all this with a grain of salt due to my lack of experience with chevy drivetrains but I do have a fair bit of experience with jeep and other 4x4 drivetrains. Good luck.
 

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There is no practical reason for the front diff of an AWD or fulltime 4wd to be any different to the front diff of any part time 4wd.

However the AWD or fulltime 4wd, need either a 3rd differential, viscous coupling, or such like that allow the front drive shaft to turn at a different speed to the rear drive shaft when the vehicle is turning on high traction surfaces - part time 4wd vehicles lack this ability so 4wd shouldn't be engaged in that situation.

Because an AWD or fulltime 4wd has a centre diff or viscous coupling, it can't be used in 2wd - with the drive to the front wheels disconnected (free wheel hubs or disconnect drive shaft) - unless the centre diff is locked (I don't know of any viscous couplings that can be locked).
 

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Isuzu reliability tester
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Discussion Starter #771
Rodeoclown you are correct and I think I would just remove the actuator and make something to keep the diff permanently connected instead of tracking down the special front diff for an SS or similar vehicle since they are special the the 2500 models are much stronger and a dime a dozen compared to the SS AWD diffs.

John I am not sure why GM decided to have the transfer case engage and the front differential engage on part time 4wd vehicles other than the slight mpg gain and less frequently moving parts to wear. The AWD vehicles like the silverado SS recieved a front diff that had both of the front axles engaged at all times with no actuator to disengage the passenger side shaft along with a mechanical transfer case that transfered power to all wheels at all times with no other options that had a viscous coupling for smooth operation around turns.

They do make transfer cases that can be AWD as well as part time 4wd or 2wd they came in many different vehicles here in the states, they even came in grand cherokees like the one I built for my wife.

The question to all this is of course will these AWD cases handle the tq of a diesel? I will assume the 149 case will since they have been behind a few big powered gasser engines but who knows. The other side of this is if I go this route I will have to go with a 4l85e to avoid costly machine work to mate the 149 to an allison or the 5r110 I have and with AWD comes great traction so what will be the next weak link? Will the tranny suffer? hmm.
 

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Even with AWD, I think traction will still be your fuse. That's a good thing.
A diesel's lumpy torque is filtered out and very smooth by the time it gets to the transfer-case. The highest loads a transfer case sees are in low gears starting to tow a load. Since you won't be towing much I think you'll be okay.
What's the expected weight of your finished truck?

To put it into perspective, my 4bd1t powered rangerover is fulltime 4wd with all open diffs (centre is manually lockable) and weighs 2300kg empty with a very even front/rear weight split.
It's possible to spin tyres off the mark by giving it at least 1500rpm before releasing the clutch, but I don't like doing that. Even in 3rd gear it can spin an inside wheel on corners.

Traction wise I think a setup like yours will work best with all independent suspension. If you run a live axle in the rear the driveshaft torque will crank down one side of the rear axle under power, taking weight off one rear wheel and the opposite corner front wheel. An independent suspension setup is immune to this behaviour, except for chassis twist which can be controlled within acceptable limits.
My rangerover has live axles front and rear with both driveshafts turning the same way. So it is also immune to this behaviour but for very different reasons.
 

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I don't know why GM did the front axle the way they did. I don't know exactly how it works, but the left and right sides unlock from each other. We aren't talking about disengaging the transfer-case. I've often wished GM would have used traditional locking hubs instead, because as it is, the cv-shafts always turn and there is a delay engaging 4WD even with a manual transfer-case. Having said that, I've never had a problem with mine. Running a tall lift, big tires, and actually trying to wheel the truck is what breaks them, from what I've read. Running the IFS in an on-road situation (other than snow) is out of my realm of knowledge, but I would think it would be fine since CV-angles shouldn't be an issue. My truck is stock height.
 

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Isuzu reliability tester
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Discussion Starter #774
So I stumbled across art morrison's site and noticed they sell mandrel bent frame sections WOOHOO! I will definately be buying a few pieces from them like the mandrel bent rear frame sections, mandrel bend driveshaft safety loop/crossmember, possibly body mounts and a couple other bits that would be impossible for me to mandrel bend in my shop. All the parts I want from them are also already in 2X4 .120 wall.

http://www.artmorrison.com/framekits.php
 

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Nice stuff. Lighter duty than you wanted though?
 

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Randy, how's the AWD unit coming along?
 

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Its been a while since this was updated... so whats the deal?

Just read through the whole build and I must say its very impressive... Hopefully will get to see more

-Chris
 

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I know this is a serious thread resurrection and im sorry.
Just wondering what happened?
Did the twin charging ever happen?
 

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I know this is a serious thread resurrection and im sorry.
Just wondering what happened?
Did the twin charging ever happen?
It didn't happen unfortunately. While the Ford was apart for the next phase I think a divorce happened. The engine went into a Jeep Grand Cherokee with a single large turbo and was sold on Ebay. Not sure what happened to the rest of the bits or indeed what happened to Carcrafter. I had a few messages from him a few years after. But that's several years ago now.
 

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Ah thats a shame to hear, thanks for the update Dougal
 
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