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No option there. It has to be a wastegate. You can't run a 6 cm turbine housing without it. There are 3 turbos in that family. The basic model that came on the P pump 4bt has a 40 mm inducer. The next step up is the 44 mm inducer. That's probably the best one if you think about twins. The big daddy is the Super HX30W with the 46 mm inducer. That's probably the biggest single you can use on a 4bt without issues. They boost extremely fast and can go into the 30 psi + boost range. Another option is the HE221W. That one boost lightning fast and also has a good reputation. Takes some adapting to use it but those who own one swear by it. The HX30W's would be a direct bolt on. The exhaust housing is about an inch longer than your H1C so you may or may not have to adjust there.
 

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Discussion Starter · #62 ·
Well, I bought into the Blue Star. Now, I can post additional pics of the dash for daytime and night time. Mike
Land vehicle Vehicle Car Motor vehicle Steering wheel Vehicle Gauge Cockpit Measuring instrument Car
 

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Discussion Starter · #63 · (Edited)
No option there. It has to be a wastegate. You can't run a 6 cm turbine housing without it. There are 3 turbos in that family. The basic model that came on the P pump 4bt has a 40 mm inducer. The next step up is the 44 mm inducer. That's probably the best one if you think about twins. The big daddy is the Super HX30W with the 46 mm inducer. That's probably the biggest single you can use on a 4bt without issues. They boost extremely fast and can go into the 30 psi + boost range. Another option is the HE221W. That one boost lightning fast and also has a good reputation. Takes some adapting to use it but those who own one swear by it. The HX30W's would be a direct bolt on. The exhaust housing is about an inch longer than your H1C so you may or may not have to adjust there.
And, therein is the issue. I only have about 3/8" between the downpipe and the firewall. In order to install the HX30W, I'll need an exhaust manifold that has the exhaust flange a bit forward. Or, find a downpipe with a shorter and sharper bend out of the rear of the turbo. My current setup is a 6bt manifold with ports 1 and 6 cut off and capped. I'm also using a Dodge factory downpipe. It does not have a short and sharp bend.
I'll research it over the Winter and that will be my Spring project. It won't be long, and the RC will be mothballed until March. Gotta get some miles in, in the next couple weeks.
 

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And, therein is the issue. I only have about 3/8" between the downpipe and the firewall. In order to install the HX30W, I'll need an exhaust manifold that has the exhaust flange a bit forward. Or, find a downpipe with a shorter and sharper bend out of the rear of the turbo. My current setup is a 6bt manifold with ports 1 and 6 cut off and capped. I'm also using a Dodge factory downpipe. It does not have a short and sharp bend.
I'll research it over the Winter and that will be my Spring project. It won't be long, and the RC will be mothballed until March. Gotta get some miles in, in the next couple weeks.
Mike, I used a 6BT manifold and cut off #1 and #2 to move the turbo on farther forward on my 4BTA and create more firewall clearance. I don't have A/C so there's no interference with the alternator. I was concerned about the 3+1 "split" creating an imbalance with my H1C, but it seemed to work OK. The HX30W has an "open chamber" without the divider, so it's a moot point now.

Good luck, Mike
 

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Discussion Starter · #65 ·
Hey guys, Wow, I haven't updated my build in almost a year and a half. Not much to report, except...I finally ordered a new Super HX30w turbo. I can't wait to get it installed. It's an upgrade I've been drooling to do.
I just hHave to figure out what to do with the downpipe. As it is now, the downpipe is about 3/8 inch away from the firewall and the new HX30w will push the downpipe back about 1.5 inches. So, either cut out 2 inches of my Dodge factory downpipe and hope the vband lip welds back on at the right angle. Or, buy a Dodge factory style downpipe from Diamond Eye Performance. It has a shorter and sharper bend just past the vband. But, they only make it in a 4 inch pipe. I'm gonna try to see if they will custom fab a 3 inch pipe with the same bends as their 4 inch pipe. We'll see...
 

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Good to hear from you again. Yes, the firewall clearance get to be a problem. Seems like I've seen a cobra head type exhaust down pipe being made for the smaller turbos. Not exactly a cheap part though. Seems like it's still about 3" total space. I believe a company called Turbonetics is doing those. Another possible is a tight 90 deg elbow that came on some HX35W turbos. I actually have the one in the photo below and can measure that for you. Not exactly an easy part to find but they are out there. The other is the one found on the Dodges. That may have too much angle to clear the fire wall. Here are some photos of those two parts.
 

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Discussion Starter · #67 ·
Good to hear from you again. Yes, the firewall clearance get to be a problem. Seems like I've seen a cobra head type exhaust down pipe being made for the smaller turbos. Not exactly a cheap part though. Seems like it's still about 3" total space. I believe a company called Turbonetics is doing those. Another possible is a tight 90 deg elbow that came on some HX35W turbos. I actually have the one in the photo below and can measure that for you. Not exactly an easy part to find but they are out there. The other is the one found on the Dodges. That may have too much angle to clear the fire wall. Here are some photos of those two parts.
Thanks. Ya, that downpipe in second pic is too much angle. But, that elbow in the first pic could work. Attached are pics of the Diamond Eye 4 inch downpipe with the close and tight bend and a pic of a factory Dodge downpipe (not mine). It looks like a couple inches or more could be cut out and re-weld the vband lip to the pipe. Or, I could just go with a 4 inch exhaust to the rear corner. Which, would suck since that 3 inch exhaust is only 4 years old. Lots of options though.
 

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You generally don't need or want a 4" exhaust on a 4bt. That 4" unit probably takes up 6-8" of space. That 6bt elbow I showed is part # 3928032. You note it has flanges on both ends. I'll try to measure it today at lunch. I believe it's under 4" total. That one in the second photo you mentioned has a section of 3" exhaust pipe still attached. I'll measure it too. May not be as big as you think. The piece from Turbonetics I mentioned would do fine as well, it's just $300. Of course it comes with all the clamps and parts. Here's what it looks like.
 

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Discussion Starter · #69 · (Edited)
You generally don't need or want a 4" exhaust on a 4bt. That 4" unit probably takes up 6-8" of space. That 6bt elbow I showed is part # 3928032. You note it has flanges on both ends. I'll try to measure it today at lunch. I believe it's under 4" total. That one in the second photo you mentioned has a section of 3" exhaust pipe still attached. I'll measure it too. May not be as big as you think. The piece from Turbonetics I mentioned would do fine as well, it's just $300. Of course it comes with all the clamps and parts. Here's what it looks like.
That looks like it would work...Except, for the cost. I talked to the designer at Diamond Eye today. They don't make a 3 inch pipe anymore. He said he's done a bunch of 3 inch custom pipe work as the company was getting off the ground. But now, he's behind on filling orders and doesn't want to stop production for one custom pipe. He also said he expects to catch up on orders in June and may be able to do a custom pipe at that time. I don't want to wait until June or later.
What do you think about an adapter to couple the end of the downpipe to the 3 inch exhaust pipe? Or, would that create another problem?
Also, if you look at the Dodge factory downpipe a couple posts above, it looks as if a good 3 inches could be cut out of it and re-weld the v-band lip back on.
 

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You may not believe it, but that tight 90 Cummins elbow I pictured in post 66 is more expensive than that cobra head. I tried to see if I could find you one of those and a new one is over $300. Of course that's not shocking for anything from Cummins. Apparently that was not a widely used part. I have only seen one that was on an engine plus the one I have. Another idea that might be easier and less expensive. You can get a 2.5" heavy stainless elbow for a tad under $20 on ebay. Here's a link. https://www.ebay.com/itm/2-5-OD-90-...e=STRK:MEBIDX:IT&_trksid=p2055119.m1438.l2649 Then get the stainless flange and clamp for $18. Here's a link. https://www.ebay.com/itm/2-5-V-Band...e=STRK:MEBIDX:IT&_trksid=p2055119.m1438.l2649 Weld the two together and you have a short down pipe. Then you get a 2.5" to 3" fitting to couple that to your exhaust pipe for $16. Here's a link. https://www.ebay.com/itm/Universal-...ash=item28508f4d88:g:d6IAAOSwH2dafWdE&vxp=mtr Then it's a matter of welding it all together. For less than $100 you can probably make a very high quality down pipe mated to your original exhaust.
 

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Discussion Starter · #71 · (Edited)
Woo Hoo, it's in. Actually, the Super HX30w was delivered yesterday. I have to do a few minor mods. But, it's going in.
For those that are turbo competent, remove or keep the silencer ring? Any difference in performance? Or, is it just for the whistle?
Thanks, Mike
 

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LOL keep the ring in there as the Whistle gets annoying when the radio is not on and you're on the turbo! JMHO Your build is looking real nice by the way so go have some fun with it! Any mileage numbers ?
 

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Discussion Starter · #73 ·
LOL keep the ring in there as the Whistle gets annoying when the radio is not on and you're on the turbo! JMHO Your build is looking real nice by the way so go have some fun with it! Any mileage numbers ?
Thanks. No MPG numbers yet. One of these days, I'll get those and post it up. I'm fairly curious myself.
 

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Discussion Starter · #74 ·
Hey Guys, this where I'm at now. The Super HX30w is bolted down. Oil inlet and outlet is clocked vertical. Oil outlet silicone hose connected. Compressor housing is clocked so I could connect to the crossover tube. I Know, that's a lot of clamps within 10 inches. But, it's a variety of machined adapter, coupler, silicone reducer and humps hoses. And, at least these are genuine T-clamps as opposed to the radiator hose style clamps that came on the 4bt. It's not pretty. But, will work for now.
Just waiting on steel braided oil hose and have the down pipe at the muffler shop to remove about 3 inches and re-weld v-band lip to pipe. I should receive those Monday or Tuesday. Almost there...
 

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Discussion Starter · #76 ·
Thanks Ed, I'll keep that in mind as I watch the EGTs. An intercooler may be the next upgrade if the EGTs are too high.

That being said, I got the factory down pipe back from the muffler shop today. What a difference. He cut out nearly 3 inches of pipe and re-welded the v-band lip back on. In the pic, both pipes are 89 thru 93 Dodge CTD factory 4x4 down pipes. I wanted to show the difference. And obviously, I wanted to use the pipe with the heat shield. That modified pipe should tuck in nicely between the turbo and firewall with a little room to spare.
The shop didn't charge me a dime. Mainly, because he didn't want to guarantee the pipe angle and fitment. He just said if it works, bring him some Bud Light...LOL. He's also the same guy that installed my new exhaust in the RC 5 years ago after the 4bt swap. So, I've gotten to know him fairly well.
Almost finished with the HX30w turbo upgrade.
 

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If it works, you better upgrade the beer!

Ed
 

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Discussion Starter · #78 ·

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I think you'll find the intercooler will be a necessary addition for any kind of boost level. That Super HX30W will easily go to 30 PSI and a bit more and EGT's will get a bit uncomfortable. Have to remember at those boost levels the air is probably around 300 deg or better. Hot air makes poor power. Need to shed that heat.
 

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Discussion Starter · #80 ·
I think you'll find the intercooler will be a necessary addition for any kind of boost level. That Super HX30W will easily go to 30 PSI and a bit more and EGT's will get a bit uncomfortable. Have to remember at those boost levels the air is probably around 300 deg or better. Hot air makes poor power. Need to shed that heat.
Thanks Charles. Yep, I'm already looking into it should I need it. Been checking out various make and universal intercoolers and scoping out my radiator support for where to cut out holes. I believe I have enough room behind the grill.
 
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