Cummins 4BT & Diesel Conversions Forums banner
1 - 20 of 29 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,391 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I just changed fuel additives once I finally used up my tankfull of 'winter' fuel. I switched from Power Service Diesel Fuel Supplement, which prevents winter gelling and fungus/bacteria, to Power Service Desel Kleen with Cetane Booster [silver bottle]. This is the supplement used in summer.

I put in a double dose. Each doseage according to label instruction adds 3 points to the Cetane rating of dieself fuel, so I added 6 points by doubling up. Then when I got fuel today I added some more, but spaced out when I was pouring: added ANOTHER double dose ha ha!

The ride home through the mountains was one fun trip. That Baby Cummins is singing now! Stronger bottom end, easier and freer revs to the top, better mid-range and even a crisper exhaust note. Really very noticeable, and even with only the 1st double dose to 6 points Cetane boost. If you haven't tried it you might consider it, especially if you've got a task that calls for a bit more Uuumph. Me, I'm convinced.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
808 Posts
Yup ! I talked with one of the Power Service engineers back in 2005. He recommended a double dose to raise the cetane 6 points and get extra lubricity. In non freezing months, I run double does in all my trucks. I like it.

Paul
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
212 Posts
I need to do some more testing but in my wife's TDI I've noticed a small MPG drop (2-3 MPG......Car gets 44 MPG) while using the same additive (not anti-gelling) through the winter here in NC. I haven't used any since March but I think I'm going to go drop some more in this morning and see what we get. I make her keep meticoulus records, but I can't say anything about how she decides to and when she puts her foot into it :) so there may be some unknowns. Just my 2 cents.

I mainly use it for the lube properties when she fills up at a station in town that now uses the ULSD. Our Pump Duece is extremely suseptiple to wear from low lubrication. I have usd it in both ULSD and LSD and no change in MPG just a drop when I add the Kleen every time.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,391 Posts
Discussion Starter · #4 ·
The major package stores, Wally World et all, sell gallon jugs of 2 stroke boat oil, or at least they did last year. It's cheap, but it's pretty good low ash oil. I make up a brew of boat oil, Marvel Mystery Oil, and Power Service all added to my tank. I use roughly 2 parts Marvel, 2 parts boat oil and 10 parts Power Service, but mostly however I happen to slosh it out. This last batch really had some wham to it and I'm sure the pump and all is well lubed! Marvel is a little pricier but I like it, and the boat oil is real cheap in bulk, both well worth the addition of a few of ounces per 10 gallons. Cheap insurance.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
197 Posts
I just emptied out a 2 gallon 2 stroke oil reservoir in my boat to switch over to Mercury Optimax oil. Will the 2-stroke oil just give lubricity or do you get some performance increase?
My brother gets enough increase in miles with that stuff on his Jetta Tdi that he says he saves $50 each time he buys a jug of the lubricating cetane booster. That's $50 above the cost of each jug going back into his pocket.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
212 Posts
Hmmm I must have bought a few bad bathes. Like I said I'm going to try doing a few more tanks here this month.

An extra 50 bucks. How big of jugs is he buying? Each jug would have to produce the equivalant of approx 17 gallons of #2 fuel energy.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,391 Posts
Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Hey DW,

Can't really say on any performance increase being due to the oil alone. Haven't driven it all that much, several hundred miles is all. Also I just moved so I'm driving in new areas. We do know that these oils are fuel, but I haven't ever added just the oil, and I've never run without Power Service.

My guess is that these lightweight oils are approximately equal in available power to diesel when combusted. Of course the benefit is in the injection pump and injectors, before it goes in the cylinder. Other than that, dunno!?? No doubt of the difference when the Diesel Kleen is added! For me it was very noticeable when pulling long steep grades, and even in town. It works.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
41 Posts
I add a quart of tranny fluid and a quart of Power Service in my 83 ranger every fillup. Engine runs alot smoother and has a little more power ive noticed than running just straight diesel. Not sure which one is doing the job. :) Im not sure about other places but I am still able to buy normal diesel, not the ULSD. Not sure how long its going to last but im going to use it as long as it is availible. Few cents cheaper too! :grinpimp:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,391 Posts
Discussion Starter · #9 ·
I add a quart of tranny fluid and a quart of Power Service in my 83 ranger every fillup. Engine runs alot smoother and has a little more power ive noticed than running just straight diesel. Not sure which one is doing the job. :) Im not sure about other places but I am still able to buy normal diesel, not the ULSD. Not sure how long its going to last but im going to use it as long as it is availible. Few cents cheaper too! :grinpimp:
MAN! How big of a tank do you have? 1 quart Power Service Diesel Kleen treats 100 gallons at 3 points cetane increase, 50 gallons @ 6 points, 25 gallons @ 12 points. Rangers have about a 25 gallon tank, don't they? Yeah, I'll bet you do see a performance increase haha!

The Diesel Kleen already has the extra lubricants in it so you wouldn't really need the tranny fluid at all. Most that use it would add about 2-4 ounces ATF to 25 gallons, w/o Power Service. I don't suppose it would hurt anything to add more though...
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
696 Posts
I add a quart of tranny fluid and a quart of Power Service in my 83 ranger every fillup. Engine runs alot smoother and has a little more power ive noticed than running just straight diesel. Not sure which one is doing the job. :) Im not sure about other places but I am still able to buy normal diesel, not the ULSD. Not sure how long its going to last but im going to use it as long as it is availible. Few cents cheaper too! :grinpimp:
I have 5 gal of ATF that I no longer need, as I now have a manual. I was going to give it to my brother in law. Should I put it in my tank enstead? Are there any downsides/risks to running ATF through the pump/injectors? or is it OK if the amount is a small %?

Gaza
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
696 Posts
I would be concerned about adding RED ATF to my fuel and then getting my tank dipped. Doesn't take much red dye to show up.
This did cross my mind, if I was dipped and had put red atf in them I would tell them this and they would presumably test more comprehensively. I suspect that some of these diesel additives could also be red.

Gaza
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,391 Posts
Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Seems it might make a difference exactly which ATF you used? Various types are for specific applications, and sometimes to match with the tranny seals to prevent deterioration. These could be Nitrile, Buna-N, neoprene, rubber etc. I don't know for sure, but I'd use it, in small quantities. Power Service Diesel Kleen dilution is 32oz quart per 100 gallons to give an idea. There's 128 oz per gal US. Seems you could double that safely, as a quart @ per 50 gal. using ATF. I'm too thick to complete the calculation for Liters....
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
8,976 Posts
I'm curious as to why you guys are having problems.

Over here we've been on LSD full time for a few years. I ran my truck on the few stations that sold it in advance for a few years before that. My truck has an inline pump, which is of course oil lubricated.

There were people who thought that LSD was killing the seals in their VE pumps and causing leaks, but statistically the problem was no different to the swap from summer to winter diesel in the years before.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,391 Posts
Discussion Starter · #15 ·
No problems for me, Dougal! What I do is entirely preventive medicine, not a cure for problems. The sulphur in the diesel acted as a lubricant of sorts, and without it the lubricity of diesel fuel is compromised. The VE pump relies on diesel fuel alone for its lubrication, and the seal integrity is aided by the fuel's lubricity. Personally, I doubt the sulphur had any effect whatsoever on seals, as it's too 'hard' a substance to lube a soft rubber seal.

But, Marvel Mystery Oil, 2 stroke oil or ATF can lubricate, and can help protect seals. So for me I'm just trying to protect parts from early failure.

By the way, is Marvel Mystery Oil available down your way?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
41 Posts
MAN! How big of a tank do you have? 1 quart Power Service Diesel Kleen treats 100 gallons at 3 points cetane increase, 50 gallons @ 6 points, 25 gallons @ 12 points. Rangers have about a 25 gallon tank, don't they? Yeah, I'll bet you do see a performance increase haha!

The Diesel Kleen already has the extra lubricants in it so you wouldn't really need the tranny fluid at all. Most that use it would add about 2-4 ounces ATF to 25 gallons, w/o Power Service. I don't suppose it would hurt anything to add more though...
Ha Ha! I use these little half quart bottles that I get at a local tractor implement store. I have a 17 gallon tank. The reason I use trans fluid is to clean the pump and injectors and also keep all the old seals swelled up in the IP. Plus I dont think theres such a thing as too much lubricity. VE pumps like lube.:D As far as the red making my diesel looking like red dye I have had no problems. I do not put in more than one quart for 17 gallons. I took my own sample and I could not see any red. Still nice and green:D
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,391 Posts
Discussion Starter · #18 ·
Never heard of it, what's the mystery?
That's the Mystery, what it is! One of the most closely guarded corporate secrets in the history of automodiledom!! Some have speculated that it's automatic trans fluid but apparently not, as tests haven't revealed that. It's designed as a top cylinder lubricant for any internal combustion engine, and may be added to crankcase oil, fuel etc.

The California Highway Patrol has had very strict standards for many years, and it is the only aftermarket additive that was allowed in pursuit vehicles. Not only that, but it was ORDERED to be put in ALL pursuit vehicles!

More info: http://www.turtlewax.com/main.taf?p=2,2,1
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
8,976 Posts
That's the Mystery, what it is! One of the most closely guarded corporate secrets in the history of automodiledom!! Some have speculated that it's automatic trans fluid but apparently not, as tests haven't revealed that. It's designed as a top cylinder lubricant for any internal combustion engine, and may be added to crankcase oil, fuel etc.

The California Highway Patrol has had very strict standards for many years, and it is the only aftermarket additive that was allowed in pursuit vehicles. Not only that, but it was ORDERED to be put in ALL pursuit vehicles!

More info: http://www.turtlewax.com/main.taf?p=2,2,1
Interesting.
Because we do get the whole slew of turtle products, but I've never seen those sold.
See the disclaimer about it not fitting the "low sulphur" requirements?
There's a big clue right there.

Personally I'm against using additives. If they were needed the engine makers would let us know.
But one gear oil additive which does work well is sold here as "Power Up".
The usual miracle BS claims follow, but it does make gearboxes run cooler to the touch and it does make oil stick to steel rather wheel (doesn't wipe or run off easily).
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,391 Posts
Discussion Starter · #20 ·
Thanks for the update, Dougal, but you know, I haven't a clue what they're talking about. I mean that literally: zero comprehension of what they're saying or trying to say regarding ULSD.

I do know this: diesel is the only lubricant that's getting to the VE pump to protect it, so whatever constituents are in that diesel may or may not add to lubricity. We, friends and I, have used Marvel for well over 30 years, more like 40, and have found it to be an amazing product for upper cylinder lube and to keep valve train functioning properly. When added to petrol it also cleans injectors and keeps a carbie cleaner and apparently aids in reducing carbon fouling in combustion chamber. Based on past experience with the amazing properties of this stuff, whatever it is, I can recommend it to anyone, even for use as a diesel fuel additive. Also I find that a whole bunch of guys who post on other diesel forums use it regularly, and like me, won't run without it.

Not really trying to convince you, but just to give you an idea of what it's all about. There's lots of other products but I happen to like this one. If it's not available there it could be because it contains petroleum distillates that are know to cause cancer as the label warning states. Then again, from what I read, just about everything but pure oxygen causes cancer, and it is suspect ha haha!

Hey, maybe you could become the sole Marvel Mystery Oil importer for NZ and move into early retirement? Might pay for lots of new toys...? :~ )
 
1 - 20 of 29 Posts
Top