[dusty]

mystery bell pattern and flywheel

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Borg-Warner 4 speed tranny t19 married to a 87 4bt

is this a gm pattern bell or a ford pattern bell? sure looks like a ford pattern but is the ford pattern commonl;y 385 series or small block

objective is to run a short 6.5" input equipt nv4500 originally i am thinking gm flywheel to AA gm bellhousing for a nv4500

thoughts?
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1979 cherokee chief 401 nv4500/D300 4bt canidate
2003 Dodge 3500 4x4
1996 F250 cummins convert 1999 NV5600/ 12v wh1c/ht3b twins np205 D60/D80 power loks F&R 400k miles - sold 2003
1998 dodge 12v nv5600 4x4 twins hx35/s400 185k - sold 2006

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Last edited by dusty : 07-19-2007 at 02:02 PM.


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#2 07-18-2007, 12:39 PM
averagef250
Registered User Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: portland, or
Posts: 76



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Sounds like a small block Ford bellhousing T-19. You can mate a dodge NV4500 to a Ford bellhousing with an AA plate.
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Dustin
Manual Transmission Service
1970 F-250 4x4 ZF S6-650 6 speed NP205 HP60 D70B 35" BFG Muds 12V swap in progress
1971 F-250 4x4 M5R2 BW1356 HP44 D60 35" BFG Muds 4BT 20 MPG city 26 freeway


#3 07-18-2007, 06:17 PM
4bt Terra
Registered User Join Date: May 2007
Location: los angeles
Posts: 11



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Forget the AA plate big $$$$ just use dodge 6bt flywheel cover and nv4500 bellhousing usually around $100-200 for the pair and it bolts right up.



#4 07-18-2007, 06:21 PM
averagef250
Registered User Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: portland, or
Posts: 76



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The AA plate is $200. ****EDIT***. Sometimes the mechanical clutch linkage is nice to keep in an older truck.
__________________
Dustin
Manual Transmission Service
1970 F-250 4x4 ZF S6-650 6 speed NP205 HP60 D70B 35" BFG Muds 12V swap in progress
1971 F-250 4x4 M5R2 BW1356 HP44 D60 35" BFG Muds 4BT 20 MPG city 26 freeway


#5 07-18-2007, 10:07 PM
dusty
Registered User Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: sonoma county ca
Posts: 19



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the only down side about the plate is i would have to buy a new input shaft for the nv4500 already in the jeep.

i already have a dodge bell and flywheel but im hoping to ditch them in search of a gm flywheel


Oh yeah already have a 4bt with a rod hanging out of it and a gm adapter....

so i have
ford adapter ford flywheel
Gm adapter no flywheel
Dodge flywheel, dodge bell (down side is dodge uses hydraulic i want to maintain my linkage)
NV4500 with short 6.5" input shaft
I do have access to a CNC machine so i could take the gm adapter down and have a friend recut one 10* clocked.
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Last edited by dusty : 07-19-2007 at 01:59 PM.



#6 07-19-2007, 12:03 AM
averagef250
Registered User Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: portland, or
Posts: 76



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I'll do you even better... ****EDIT**** the light duty 1 1/8" dodge input will go with the AA plate ***EDIT*** but it won't fit the low first '95 and earlier NV4500 though.

Sounds like you've got a pretty good handle on it though.

I just hate the 8 degree or so chev/cummins adapter angle.
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#7 07-19-2007, 06:34 AM
dusty
Registered User Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: sonoma county ca
Posts: 19



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***EDIT***

thats interesting now currently my nv4500 tranny has the 1-1/8" input which is 6.5" long the stock dodge is 7.25" long and 1-1/4" my understanding is the ford bellhousings are 6.5" deep so adding the plate would add 3/4" which would necesitate tracking down a 7.25" input and a different clutch? right? if the input shaft you have is 7.25-7.5" from a dodge gas rig and 1-1/8" id possibly be interested in looking at that swap


Your onto my line of thinking i want to keep the old mechanical linkage, ultimately id like to make it where the bellhousing and the engine are the only two things that need to come out. so that if i ever want to stick the 401 back in for some saturday night entertainment i could and it wouldnt be a major undertaking.
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Last edited by dusty : 07-19-2007 at 07:06 AM.




#8 07-19-2007, 10:53 AM
averagef250
Registered User Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: portland, or
Posts: 76



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I don't know the measurements, but the dodge light and HD input shafts both work with the AA plate and any Ford truck bellhousing.

You will need to change the clutch disc as Ford is 1 1/6 10 spline. You'll need a chevy/dodge 12" 1 1/8" disc.
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#9 07-19-2007, 12:37 PM
dusty
Registered User Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: sonoma county ca
Posts: 19



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well im interested now in looking at that avenue.

gotta do a little research on the input bearing retainer as mine was a dodge thick unit that i machined down to work with the chevy/jeep throw out bearing as per AA and thier bellhousing but you might just have a buyer for those pieces.

thanks ford tid bits on adaptability of these parts i think i might be formulating a different plan on how im going to tie my 4bt to my nv4500
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Edited thread removed offers from helpful parties offering possible solutions via spare parts they had lying around to id my quest for an answer to adapting my nv4500 to the 4bt. In the future if you think you have a part that might be of asistance please dont offer it on thread aparently that is a conflict of interest with vendors so best to keep that good stuff to pms. hopefully this thread will provide mor einfo for others seeking to marry a nv4500 also.


THANX

 

[averagef250]

Hope it works out! Remember, just be sure your NV4500 isn't an early chevy version with the low first. These trannies have different everything inside.

I didn't realize there was a problem offering parts in forums. I'm used to forums that are user supported and friendlier, not vendor supported.

 

[dusty]

me too. usually its not when a private party or two says " hey ive got a part in my garage that might help you" more so they get mad when someone says" hey check out my website or company call us we have the part for you" without being a vendor.

As it is you are correct the input shaft and gears are all cut differently in the 92/93 and early 94 chevy trannies as well the bolt pattern on the face of the tranny is different from the 94+ dodge and chevy trannies easy way to distinguish is 6.32:1 first gear vs the 5.63:1 first in all others.

As it is the early chevy trannies are becoming ahrd to get parts for many have been discontinued. Also 1st and reverse are not syncronized so what you gain in crawl ratio you may be loosing to headaches down the road.


the 1-1/8 input has been proven to hold up to 450-500 ft/lbs torque id be nervous after that about fracturing it after that as t-18's and NP435s have had thier shadre of fractured inputs in 6bt swaps that have pushed the hp/ torque number past 500-550 ft/lbs. in many cases they last but id hate to find out in the middle of nevada at night that my input had decided to let loose without warning