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Discussion Starter #1
i need to know if ford ever put an automatic behind a 6.9 diesel in a 4x4.


all i need is the transmission and the t-case but every junkyard that i have asked at said that there is no such thing, does anyone out there know if there is a married trans/t-case that will bolt up to a 6.9??



i hope someone knows, sure will make the bronco project go by faster....
 

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The 6.9 came with a C6. I believe that the bellhousing bolt pattern is the same as the 7.3s, so the E4OD and 4R100 should fit.
 

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the 6.9/7.3 IDI engines use a Ford "385" series bolt pattern these tranies are found in ost all 4wd trucks with the C-6 and either a 205 or a 203 Ihave also seen a dana 21 with is a single speed unit but only behind the manual trans in later years of truck 80-87? ford used the c6 with a BW1356? it has a slipyoke i nit and many consider it to be junk? but I haven't seen a broken one but there is now SYE kit for them but the good news is Ford didnd change much so you can bolt a Ford 205 to where a BW 1356 was with all stock stuff in some cases with the same adapter ive only seen 2 different adaptors 1 is about 5" long and the other is 7" long just make sure that what you are putting on is the same length as the one u took off shaft size "dia" spline count and bolt pattern are al lthe some for fords not sure about the New superduties tho I heard the New NV271 Tcase is one stout mother!!!!with a fixed yoke too
FORD RULES!!!!!
 

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Discussion Starter #4
the 6.9/7.3 IDI engines use a Ford "385" series bolt pattern these tranies are found in ost all 4wd trucks with the C-6 and either a 205 or a 203 Ihave also seen a dana 21 with is a single speed unit but only behind the manual trans in later years of truck 80-87? ford used the c6 with a BW1356? it has a slipyoke i nit and many consider it to be junk? but I haven't seen a broken one but there is now SYE kit for them but the good news is Ford didnd change much so you can bolt a Ford 205 to where a BW 1356 was with all stock stuff in some cases with the same adapter ive only seen 2 different adaptors 1 is about 5" long and the other is 7" long just make sure that what you are putting on is the same length as the one u took off shaft size "dia" spline count and bolt pattern are al lthe some for fords not sure about the New superduties tho I heard the New NV271 Tcase is one stout mother!!!!with a fixed yoke too
FORD RULES!!!!!


when you say "385" series are you saying that it has the same bellhousing pattern as the 351m/400, 429/460??? cuz if that is what you mean then you are DEAD WRONG, i pulled the 400 out of the bronco and the bellhousing patterns are completely different.....someone told me that they would work but it ended up not working....



so out of the 2 which is stronger? the E4OD or the 4R100? what years did they come in? what t-case is attached??
 

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I just finished installing a 4R100 in place of a E4OD in my 1996 Power Stroke. Everything bolts up the same, but there are a few odds and ends that need to be "converted". The shifter linkage that the cable attaches to is just slightly bigger and a different design, and the transmission cooler lines are bigger, thus requiring adapters.

The Ford small blocks: 300 I6, 302 V8, 351 V8 Windsor take the "small block" transmission.

The Ford big blocks: 351 V8 Clevland, 390 V8, 429 V8, 460 V8 take the "big block" transmission.

The Ford diesel blocks: 6.9L, 7.3L and 6.0L take the "diesel" transmission.
 

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No,
Big block/small block is a chevy only term. Sure it's used a lot to describe other things, but you cannot describe any Ford engine without qualifying which engine series it is.
No, small block is NOT just a Chevy term. It's been used for Fords since the 221 cube 90 degree V8 first came out around 1960, just as small block term has been used for Chevys since the 265 first came out in 1955. When Ford made them bigger than 302, and starting coming out with W, C, or M engines in 351 and 400 versions, things got confusing. Most people I worked around with during the 60s used small-block for the 221s, 260s, 289s, and 302s -but beyond that they were just called by their specific names. The older Ford 272s, 292s, and 312s were "Y-blocks", and the bigger engines e.g. 332, 352, 390, 409, 427, 428, 429, etc. were all big blocks regardless of their differences.

If a term is commonly used, and people understand it, than - it exists. I've been working on this junk since the 50s, and "small block" was commonly used for Ford and Chevy. So was big block. It just so happens Chevy had their small block out 5 years before Ford.



Ford diesel pattern is Ford diesel pattern only. The 385 pattern is very close, from what I hear you can drill and tap the two uppermost bolt holes in the block or modify the bellhousing to make these work, but you are ahead of the game to get the right diesel tranny, especially auto.
Ford diesel is NOT any Ford pattern - it is International Harvester pattern that is also used in big med-duty trucks. Ford uses a special transmission adapter on the back of all the 6.9 and 7.3 diesels to make many transmissions fit.
 

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No, small block is NOT just a Chevy term. It's been used for Fords since the 221 cube 90 degree V8 first came out around 1960, just as small block term has been used for Chevys since the 265 first came out in 1955. When Ford made them bigger than 302, and starting coming out with W, C, or M engines in 351 and 400 versions, things got confusing. Most people I worked around with during the 60s used small-block for the 221s, 260s, 289s, and 302s -but beyond that they were just called by their specific names. The older Ford 272s, 292s, and 312s were "Y-blocks", and the bigger engines e.g. 332, 352, 390, 409, 427, 428, 429, etc. were all big blocks regardless of their differences.

If a term is commonly used, and people understand it, than - it exists. I've been working on this junk since the 50s, and "small block" was commonly used for Ford and Chevy. So was big block. It just so happens Chevy had their small block out 5 years before Ford.





Ford diesel is NOT any Ford pattern - it is International Harvester pattern that is also used in big med-duty trucks. Ford uses a special transmission adapter on the back of all the 6.9 and 7.3 diesels to make many transmissions fit.
Anyways... as far as Ford trucks are concerned, there are these 3 different transmissions that I mentioned above: The diesel pattern transmission, the small block pattern transmission, and the big block pattern transmission.
 

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...
Ford diesel is NOT any Ford pattern - it is International Harvester pattern that is also used in big med-duty trucks....
The IH spec 6.9/7.3 IDIs used SAE #2 flywheel housings with no adapter between them and the block, I currently have several of them. They are used in IH trucks like the medium duty S-series and are nothing like the adapter used on the Ford spec 6.9/7.3 IDI engines of which I recently owned one. All 6.9/7.3 IDIs(Ford or IH spec) had the same IH bell pattern cast into the block as the IH MV404/446 gas engines.

The adapter on the 6.9/7.3 IDI engines in the Ford F250/F350/E350 are indeed an adapter used only in the Fords. Thus it would not seem incorrect to refer to this pattern as the Ford diesel pattern in those years, atleast as far as the light duty trucks are concerned.

Ken
 

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Thank you for clearing up the Diesel pattern for us. I don't want to add fuel to the fire, just information that I remember. This is one of the reasons so many people thing Ford is nuts.

Small six cylinder pattern: 140, 170, 200, 250…..Not important for here

Small block pattern: 240 & 300 big six cylinders, ‘65-up 260, 289, 302, Boss 302, 351C, 351W…..Important

Big block FE (Ford/Edsel): 330, 352, 360, 361, 390, 391, 406, 410, 427, 428…..Not important

Big block Lima pattern: 351M, 400 (the 2 tall-deck Cleveland-style blocks),370, 429, 460…..Important

Modular V-8 pattern: 4.6L, 5.4L, 6.8?L V-10…..Important

And there is also the unimportant Y-block and MEL (Mercury/Edsel/Lincoln) block of the 50s
 

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Discussion Starter #10
anyways....since there is now a bunch of completely useless block info here.....can someone get back to my original question?????
so out of the 2 which is stronger? the E4OD or the 4R100? what years did they come in? what t-case is attached??
for future discussion in this thread here is a tip-if the engine has spark plugs then i dont want to hear about it....
 

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anyways....since there is now a bunch of completely useless block info here.....can someone get back to my original question?????


for future discussion in this thread here is a tip-if the engine has spark plugs then i dont want to hear about it....
E40D has many upgrades available that can make it just as strong as the 4R100. In original form - and especially with early E40Ds, it's not as strong.
 

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Using the terms small block and big block to describe Ford bellhousings is just plain stupid. Using those terms alone to describe a ford engine is also pretty silly because you're not really saying anything.
It's the argument here that is "stupid" as you put it.

I don't think many people use those terms to describe bellhousings - so I doubt it's an issue. I grew up with this stuff and I certainly knew what it meant then, and means now.

The term has been used for many years and works fine. "Small-block" is a general statement, not a specific designation. That goes for Chevys and Fords even though small-blocks with either are NOT all the same throughout the years.

I used to have many Falcon Sprints and Carol Shelby designed Sunbeam Tigers. All used varieties of 260s and 289s stock. When jerking around with them - any other "small block" Ford could be swapped with little to no mods - whereas other Ford engines could not. Just by that simple term, one knew that any 221, 260, 289, 302 would bolt right in, and also a Boss 302, 351, or 400 would also go in but have some head-clearance issues.

Put into that context, the term was not meant of denote or imply anything else - ands works just fine.

If someone is led "astray" by it, seems the problem is one of comprehension.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
what vehicles came with a 4R100 and what transfer case is behind it?? its going into a 79 bronco so im kinda hoping for a manuel transfer case
 

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hi predatorrrr,,,, this buck,,,,, i calledd coleman tayolor, 1-866-616-0179,, askedddd the nice guy answereddd tghe phone,, he said taht altho the case will physicallly bolt up from 460, to 6.9-7.3 theree are many differences internally, one will pull if u do thais but u willl not be happy,, most ntablly is diff,torque coanverter, valve body but almso many other internal differeances,, the ford version ihc engiane has externall adapator to bolt ihc engine to standard 460 style bell housing, tall bolt pattern,,,,he also said that it is easy to build transs for diesell to 4wheel dirve marriedd tcase,,,, give him a call,,,,,i shou.dl add, coleman tayolor is commercial tanasmissions comapany,,
 

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Funny how peoples experiences are different. At the young and naive age of 17 I did an engine swap in my 65 mustang. It didn't run near as good as my 67 mustang I had wrecked. I thought both were 289 s. My 67 was a 4 speed and I had sold the tranny. So I take out the 65 motor and set in the 67. Easy swap right? NOT! The 65 turned out to be a 64 1/2, the engine was a 260, the tranny a 2 speed auto (fmx I think). The 289 would not bolt to the trannny. I bought a c4 auto and put behind it. I like the old fords and that mistake as a 17 year old was because of my ignorance of ford engine families and what engine works with what transmission. A chevy would not likely have taken such advantage of my lack of knowledge.
 
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