[marshallnoise]

Hey all, so I am getting everything fitted up and I plan on using the stock fuel filter boss on the head. I have a donor fuel filter spin on fitting and I have a fuel filter outlet to the injection pump line bolted on.

But I want to run a soft line from the lift pump outlet to the fuel inlet on the cylinder head and for that, I need a barb fitting that will screw into the cylinder head.

Does anyone know what the thread pitch is where the banjo bolt would normally go?

 

[char1355]

I believe the banjo bolt at the head is M12x1.50x24mm. If you have the bolt you should be able to confirm that. Cummins had a soft hose for the piston style lift pump but not sure about others.

 

[marshallnoise]

I believe the banjo bolt at the head is M12x1.50x24mm. If you have the bolt you should be able to confirm that. Cummins had a soft hose for the piston style lift pump but not sure about others.

Thanks Charlie. I believe this engine had a remote fuel filter set up because I know it did have a remote oil filter setup based on the oil filter housing it came with. All that to say is I don't have that banjo bolt.

 

[marshallnoise]

I was able to find an adapter to take it from M12x1.50 to 3/8" NPT. That was found at a Parker hose supply store. Not being in that industry, I was blown away by the types of products they have. Great freaking resource.

 

[marshallnoise]

Hey Charlie, I was struggling with getting oil pressure on this engine before trying to start it.

I don't want to use the remote oil filter setup that came on the engine, so I tried hooking up the 1987 6BT CPL 0716 cooler and oil filter housing. I cranked it over and got no oil pressure on my gauge nor coming out of the rocker cover.

I decided to take an oil pump I had in one of my other 6bts and hack the drive gear off and weld a nut to the pump side. That way I could spin it with a drill and not waste battery charges and make a shit ton of noise. I tried for 20 minutes and couldn't get it to produce any oil.

So I took the cooler off and looked at the 87 6bt CPL 0716 block and noticed one inlet and one outlet. My block has 3 holes under the oil cooler. I stuck my finger over the third hole and applied the drill: Wham! Ton's of flow and pressure. Oil everywhere.

Once I got that cleaned up I looked at my 6BT with a CPL of 1165 and it has a hole just the same as my 4BT. So I slapped that cooler and that housing with the original gasket that came on my 4BT and I am now getting oil pressure.

What makes me concerned is that I found this document: Storm vs. non-storm??.

I am concerned that I might be creating a problem for myself with oiling this beast. Should I not be using the CPL 1165 oil cooler/filter housing with this 4BT?

 

[char1355]

On the oil filter plate gasket, it should look like the one in the 1st photo below. The STORM gasket looks like the 2nd photo. And, there have been a few other style gaskets over the years but those were discontinued. The engine should be fine whether you use the remote filter setup or not. Those engines used the remote because their application put the filter against a wall where it was difficult to service. The fuel filter arrangement for your engine would be like the 3rd photo. I guess you'd call that remote since it doesn't use the one built into the head. Again, that was probably due to having the oil filter on that side of the block. You could use the standard fuel filter arrangement if you wanted.

 

[marshallnoise]

Thank you Charlie. I appreciate the info. I am using the gasket in the first pic you showed.

For the fuel filter, I am going to use the one in the cylinder head, but it required me to delete the breather on the tappet cover. I plan on allowing the crank to breathe through the valve covers.

 

[char1355]

Do you have the stock tappet cover? The fuel filter shouldn't come in contact with that breather. Just have to be sure you have the right fuel filter. There is even a dual filter for that application as well. Often found on industrial engines. We don't see it used too often because it gets kind of tight with the brake booster. Below are photos of the single filter arrangement and the dual one.

 

[marshallnoise]

Do you have the stock tappet cover? The fuel filter shouldn't come in contact with that breather. Just have to be sure you have the right fuel filter. There is even a dual filter for that application as well. Often found on industrial engines. We don't see it used too often because it gets kind of tight with the brake booster. Below are photos of the single filter arrangement and the dual one.

Yeah, it was the original tappet cover. It was right in the way of the filter.
IMG_20210329_172519_01 by Paul Abbott, on Flickr

I almost got the sucker started, but the very old lift pump I had gave up the ghost so I gotta get another one.

 

[char1355]

Yeah, there is a good reason for that. That 4.5 uses a different tappet cover than the 3.9. Have no idea why. Maybe an engineering improvement. The 4.5 cover is part 3965417. The 3.9 4bt uses cover 3905023. That would also explain the use of the remote filter like used on the 5.9 Dodges.

 

[marshallnoise]

Yeah, there is a good reason for that. That 4.5 uses a different tappet cover than the 3.9. Have no idea why. Maybe an engineering improvement. The 4.5 cover is part 3965417. The 3.9 4bt uses cover 3905023. That would also explain the use of the remote filter like used on the 5.9 Dodges.

Necessity is the mother of my invention/destruction here. LOL

 

[marshallnoise]

Well, I managed to get the sucker started on starting fluid, but I wasn't getting fuel through the pump. I decided to pull the injectors apart and give them a good clean. The pins looked great. And everything looked good on them.

I gave it a snort of starting fluid again after putting it back together and then I grabbed the throttle and it came to life and ran on its own! It took about 10 seconds to warm up and then it would idle on it's own. The idle is too low and I tried adjusting it, but I ran out of adjustment. So I am going to have to figure that out.

BTW, 58 PSI of oil pressure at idle and up to 90 at decent revs!

 

[Fred Wook]

Did you change out the delivery valves on the china pump?

 

[char1355]

Your oil pressure sounds a little bit on the high side. It might hit 90 PSI on a cold start but the pressure relief valve has a factory setting of 65 PSI. If it stays at the high level better be sure you're using a good quality oil filter like the Cummins brand. Those are rated to 120 PSI but some cheap units won't take that.

 

[marshallnoise]

Did you change out the delivery valves on the china pump?

Yes I did. I had to in order to let the VP30 lines fit on the VE pump. I just did it and it worked.

Your oil pressure sounds a little bit on the high side. It might hit 90 PSI on a cold start but the pressure relief valve has a factory setting of 65 PSI. If it stays at the high level better be sure you're using a good quality oil filter like the Cummins brand. Those are rated to 120 PSI but some cheap units won't take that.

I am using a Napa Silver oil filter. I have not let the engine run for more than 20 seconds so all of the oil is cold still. I will keep an eye on it when I get it installed in the truck.

 

[GLTHFJ60]

Love it.

 

[slow600]

love your science project! what vehicle is this going in?

 

[marshallnoise]

love your science project! what vehicle is this going in?

It is kind of a science project! I suppose I ought to highlight what I have done.

• Purchased a QSB4.5-30 that had the Bosch VP-30 Electronically Controlled pump
• Purchased a new VE4 pump from a seller in China
• Swapped timing case from a donor parts 6BT that I have
• Swapped the delivery valves from the VP-30 pump so the lines would fit (VP lines are the same size, but just a about an inch shorter than VE lines)
• Injectors are 260 bar units that came with the engine (I have a pop tester now and might pull them out to see what they are popping at)
• Added aftermarket 3600 RPM spring
• Added 60lb springs
• Grabbed a 6BT manifold and cut it down on the ends and welded it up tight
• Flipped the oil pan and purchased a new oil pickup tube
• Cut off and welded closed the breather on the tappet cover so I could use the as cast fuel filter provision (breathing through the valve covers now)
• Swapped oil cooler for a 6BT vertical unit
• Grabbed a piece of 3/8" hard fuel line to make a dipstick tube and used a donor 6bt dipstick.
• Filled it with 2 gallons of oil plus prefilled the oil filter
• Primed the oiling system with an old oil pump with one sprocket cut off and a nut welded to it
• New lift pump

The engine will be going in my 95 F150 that has the 300ci 6 cylinder backed up by an M5OD-R2. I have a few more things to do before starting the install. But I am not in a rush.

 

[slow600]

thank you. nice to know options, finding an on road 4bt is getting harder and harder these days.

 

[marshallnoise]

thank you. nice to know options, finding an on road 4bt is getting harder and harder these days.

Yes, and finding one at a decent price is difficult too. I picked this engine up for $1,500. I knew I could get out of it what I paid if things did not turn out well. But so far, I am tickled pink.