Cummins 4BT & Diesel Conversions Forums banner

1 - 8 of 8 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
9 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
I have some dumb questions first off, I apologize in advance for them, I have been pouring through the FAQ's and ranger swaps in here for a couple weeks now.

Truck that is getting swapped is a D60 swapped 05 ranger. Truck has sat for a couple years now, motor is long since pulled it had a non-running 6.8L swap for a bit. Life has changed going to DD this for a bit so finishing the gas guzzler of a 6.8 would be a poor choice. I will have to swap out the coils I am using now for the weight and I am going to try and do the swap without body lifting the truck. Selling my cobra to go ahead and move forward with this :(

Truck pictures attached below. Ranger is an 05, 90's F350 D60 BJ front axle, 5.38's, Yukon air locker, chromo 35 spline shafts, Yukon chromo lockouts sits on XJ lift coils that are too light for this setup. E350 D60u rear, 5.38's, miller locked, 32 spline shafts on J4000 leafs, XJ shackles, Bilstein 5100's all around. sits with about 4" of lift

Now for the dumb questions,

I have been looking at the ebay frame cuts (fedex van?) if I go with a common rail with trans, it seems like most of the stuff comes with an Allison 1000 from what I read it is the 5speed version. I can either order an OE 4wd tailshaft and do the NP263HD or I have seen adapters that convert to ford parts so I could use my doubler (NV271/NP205). Performance should be fine for me either way. No idea which will be easier, although doing the GM parts means I wont spend a fortune on cable shifters for the doubler.

Gauge cluster, I would prefer to keep the OE cluster and add a pyro/boost/trans temp to the pillar. For speed I am trying to figure out what this will pull from 2001+ should be PCM generated from the trans/tcase both of which I will lack in this scenario, although I have the tone ring in the rear diff still (D60u from a ford e350). Tach I have read in a few threads that state it goes from a sensor through the PCM...Now one huge sad thing is I will need a new PCM/harness as mine was sold with the old 4.0SOHC, thats my bad though.

Going to try and add AC back, I have read the dodge compressor works best. I will have to have the tach part figured out.

Only thing I am still missing part numbers for is vacuum/power steering pump. I am assuming that there will be something on the frame cutout. Truck has ford powersteering gearbox so that shouldn't be hard to adapt to no matter what. Mustang hydroboost has been done on these trucks so if I need to go that route no biggie in theory.

What intercooler is everyone using for these smaller trucks?

I assume the 5.0 radiator out of the explorer should suffice for this motor as well since it handles built 351's.

I have a superduty gasser tank (42 gallon) should be able to use that with a diesel filler neck I would assume?

Has anyone really shown tuning with these? I have heard rumors EFI live works. No matter what I would love to have more than 2500RPM to play with and a slight bump in power. Not really looking to do anything crazy, it might get a different turbo and some injectors...maybe. Even at stock the 170HP setup is probably plenty.
 

Attachments

·
Registered
Joined
·
11,041 Posts
Welcome to the forum. I assume you plan some very large tires with 5.38 gears or plan on going very slow. The 4bt's like to run in the 1800-2000 RPM range. Governor is probably maxxed at 2500. When you get into the common rail 4bt you need to know what issues you may be up against. That is a totally computer controlled engine. Very few performance mods are available. Those engines were rear gear train and a regular power steering pump is as rare as hens teeth No vacuum pump option that I know of. You'd want to be absolutely sure the engine/transmission came with all the cables. Even the accelerator is electronic. Very few swaps deal with that engine because of the limit of transmissions and computer nightmares. The Allison 1000 is a very good transmission and could be converted to 4x4. The transmission controller is part of the engine on board computer. You could do a manual transmission but it would have to be something with an SAE bellhousing since that's all that engine has. You might use an Eaton 6 speed but the transfer case would be divorced. The Eaton FSO6406a might work and has a 7.05 1st gear and an OD 6th. If this is crawling around only then the FS6406 has a 9.01 1st. Might not need a doubler with that one. One main thing is you want to be sure the computer units on the engine are in good condition. That ECU is probably in the $2000 range. Might contact member Steed. He's working on one of those engines right now and converting it to front gear train. We have another member putting that engine/transmission combo in a WWII vehicle. The vast majority of the swaps you'll see on the forum use the 4BT engines which are totally mechanical. Tons of power mods available and no computers.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9 Posts
Discussion Starter #3
Thanks for the information. I had seen that this was a rear gear train motor, the parts are from everyone's favorite chad guy that I saw threads about. Supposed to be running complete pulls with pedal with a run video before ship out. I am going to ask the dumb question the fedex trucks these came out of are they manual steering? I would assume there was some kind of pump on them OE. I know they are a wet brake setup so it has to have some kind of fluid pump...Not that this is the worst part that is just the matter of a bracket and a belt.

Truck currently has 39.5's on it and plans to go to 41.5's after it is chugging around under its own power again. 39.5's running 70MPH will leave the RPM's pushed up to 2200-2300RPM according to the calculators if its a 5 speed allison, 1900-2000RPM if it is the 6 speed, 41.5's drop that another 75-100RPMish for both. This might be a good choice to lower the number of tickets I typically get.

I had looked at several of the full mechanical motors and wanted to be a little different, looked at QSB 4.5's as well, but those are bloody expensive as well as even more impossible to deal with for tuning. Will have to see where I am sitting in this thread when I go to purchase in about a week. Still have to get the cobra finished to sell off before I get to excited on this.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
11,041 Posts
The QSB 4.5 industrial engine is essentially the same engine as the ISBe 3.9 with a longer stroke. In other countries they sell the ISBe 4.5 but not in the USA. Never figured that out. From what little I know about the Allison 1000, I believe the 5 speed can be converted to a 6 speed by a change in computer program. How that can be done on the Cummins/Allison combo I don't know. None of your RPM ranges are extreme. What is important is the peak torque of these engines comes in at around 1800 RPM. With those big tires that torque is important and as RPM increases the HP goes up but the torque goes down. Those trucks did have power steering but it may have been tie rod assisted. The pump was more or less a hydraulic pump and you'd need to know pressure output to see if it would be compatible with a regular power steering gear. Here's a photo that shows that pump mounted. Not sure if the brakes used it in hydroboost system or they had something else. The power steering issue has been a common bug for people wanting to use that engine. One solution is adapt a belt driven unit. Are you planning on staying with vacuum assist brakes or going hydroboost? With those big tires a tie rod assist steering may not be out of the question either.
 

Attachments

·
Registered
Joined
·
9 Posts
Discussion Starter #5
If it has a hydro pump I have enough random fork lift parts I can adapt that to work. The truck actually is in need of hydro assist and that is a later date plan. Right now it has just your standard inside the frame rail Ford box. I think it's like an 80's f150 box specifically.

For brakes I don't care hydro boost or vacuum. Whatever is easier to deal with is the route I will go. Lord knows there are plenty of 99-04 mustangs in the junkyard here in Houston that I can go pull a cheap pump and lines to convert it over.

Torque drop off with the higher rpm I expect. This is going to at bare minimum with zero tuning double what it had in it. That was still enough to run this truck happily down the freeway. I did find a thread on here that talked about one of the members being able to tune these at least into higher rpm and to the 200hp Ford spec. So might message him when things are a little further down the road.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
11,041 Posts
If you wanted to do hydroboost, one logical solution is the unit found on '87-98 Ford F Super duty diesel trucks. Probably a direct bolt on to the firewall. Mustang stuff might work too. With hydroboost you wouldn't need a vacuum pump. Just a power steering pump with dual return lines. You could adapt a ford or GM PS pump if you couldn't use the on engine pump. The standard 170 HP will probably do just fine. The torque of that engine would be like a big block gas motor. The guy working on the performance part of that engine is probably member Steed. I thing he's aiming at 300 HP now. He's a computer expert and works in the army. In Europe, the ISBe 4.5 came with a max of 210 HP and 627 lb ft of torque. That's a lot of grunt from a 4 cylinder. That torque is equal to the biggest 6bt 12 valve that Cummins offered for road use. Unfortunately, that engine is only available outside the US, yet it meets the Euro 6 smog regulations.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9 Posts
Discussion Starter #7 (Edited)
If you wanted to do hydroboost, one logical solution is the unit found on '87-98 Ford F Super duty diesel trucks. Probably a direct bolt on to the firewall. Mustang stuff might work too. With hydroboost you wouldn't need a vacuum pump. Just a power steering pump with dual return lines. You could adapt a ford or GM PS pump if you couldn't use the on engine pump. The standard 170 HP will probably do just fine. The torque of that engine would be like a big block gas motor. The guy working on the performance part of that engine is probably member Steed. I thing he's aiming at 300 HP now. He's a computer expert and works in the army. In Europe, the ISBe 4.5 came with a max of 210 HP and 627 lb ft of torque. That's a lot of grunt from a 4 cylinder. That torque is equal to the biggest 6bt 12 valve that Cummins offered for road use. Unfortunately, that engine is only available outside the US, yet it meets the Euro 6 smog regulations.
I believe the superduty hydro boost is a bigger bolt pattern. The mustang stuff interchanges for sure. I assume it'll be plenty to deal with the e350 master I have in it for the bigger brakes.

I'll have to look into the PS pump stuff a little bit more. I cannot imagine it's that bad. I am going to street drive this a lot so I don't want to swap to a straight orbital setup. Hydro assist is one thing full hydro is another lol.

I think steed was posting in the thread, but it was someone else tuning. I could be wrong. When I hit that magical post count I'll go ahead and bookmark links in here about it. Been a member since 2010, but only lurked, should have posted I guess.

And on the 5speed vs 6 speed Allison stuff. If it's based on the 01-05 truck trans it would need a valve body and TCM to convert to a 6 speed. The 06/07 based trans just needs a TCM reflash. So that'll be fun to figure out.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
11,041 Posts
I had sort of forgot you are doing Ranger instead of F series on the hydroboost unit. The Mustang may have a better bolt pattern for that size truck. The F series hydroboost unit used a big master with 1-1/8" bore because that truck had monster disc brake calipers, especially on the rear axle. If you need to know the bolt pattern on one of those I have one on my work bench. Be glad to measure it.
 
1 - 8 of 8 Posts
Top