OR a 5 speed. The important bit is they have OD. Looks like the Spicer 3053 might be a good option with a swapped-out OD gear?

 

they make a spicer 3053A which is overdrive.............

 

i thnk most of the 6 speeds are sae #2

 

The plain 3053 is also overdrive.
I think he's referring to an aftermarket faster OD kit?

Grigg

 

Precisely!

 

A six speed would be nice, but it would add both expense and complexity to your swap.They are much larger than a five speed.A five speed with either 4.11 or 3.73 gearing will be well within the Isuzu's "happy" range. I have a nv4500 behind an Isuzu 4bd1 and don't need fifth until 65 mph.

 

What would the Isuzu prefer to sit at for good MPG at 70 mph?

 

That answer also depends a whole lot on vehicle size and weight. Be sure you're comparing apples to apples.

Grigg

 

That answer also depends a whole lot on vehicle size and weight. Be sure you're comparing apples to apples.

Grigg

Of course. I will tell you that hundreds of Ford pickups in the mid to late 70's were converted to 6bd1's with stock gearing and either a C6 or a np435 tranny. Most of these trucks did not have turbos, unless home-built, but delivered around 25 mpg for the six and closer to 30 mpg for the four banger. The turbo allows enough power to utilize the overdrive on the 4bd1, whereas the 6bd has plenty even without. I have seen these trucks with over 400k on them. I believe carcrafter is making a Ford adapter or the Isuzu, allowing the use of a modern o.d transmission. Good luck.

 

Of course. I will tell you that hundreds of Ford pickups in the mid to late 70's were converted to 6bd1's with stock gearing and either a C6 or a np435 tranny.

What adapter were these trucks using?

 

I was thinking about this some more... what about a NV4500? Would that hold up to the power specs of the 6BD1T? 163bhp / 375ft-lbs @ 1800? To install, I would swap the rear housing from a 4BD1 onto the 6BD1 and utilize the 4BD/NV4500 adapter that is available. That way I likely wouldn't need to make firewall mods, as I'm assuming I will have to do with an SAE#3 adapter?

 

I was thinking about this some more... what about a NV4500? Would that hold up to the power specs of the 6BD1T? 163bhp / 375ft-lbs @ 1800?

I don't see why not, as long as you don't go nuts with power mods.

 

No, the 4500, it has a reputation amongst some to have a few issues with the diesels, I believe the fix is supposed to be a "fully threded nut", I would run it regardless.

Any transmission can be broken with enough power, hence the comment about not "going nuts" on turning the power up.

 

No, the 4500, it has a reputation amongst some to have a few issues with the diesels, I believe the fix is supposed to be a "fully threded nut", I would run it regardless.

I beleve that only applies to the Dodge version of the transmission.

Any transmission can be broken with enough power, hence the comment about not "going nuts" on turning the power up.

Certainly but your warning makes it sound like a weak transmission and it's not.

 

I dunno if I would ever put a 4500 behind a stock 6BT P-pump (190hp, 475 ft-lbs of torque)

I threw my ZF S542 to the side when I got the motor.... at 450 ft-lbs of torque.. its over its 'rated power'

With a 375 ft -lb torque rating your well within the scope of its operating parameters... so go for it.....

A duramax never had less then 500 ft lbs though I thought........ and i don't think it had a 4500 ever.......(maybe behind the old 6.5 but)

 

I dunno if I would ever put a 4500 behind a stock 6BT P-pump (190hp, 475 ft-lbs of torque)

Why not, Dodge did.

A duramax never had less then 500 ft lbs though I thought........ and i don't think it had a 4500 ever.......(maybe behind the old 6.5 but)

Through 2007 according to Wikipedia http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chevrolet_Silverado#Heavy_Duty

Edit...... oops that says 6.0L, but it was used behind the 454, too at 410 lbf·ft.

 

It was a link emailed to me.

The person who posted it claimed it was a 6BD1T Isuzu.

It's the only place I've seen it and of course I can't find it at the moment.

 

The Dodge NV4500 will easily take 500 ftlbs of torque. The issue was with 5 gear coming loose and sliding back off of the mainshaft. There are several fixes for this from an upgraded retainer nut, welding the gear to the mainshaft, or even a fully splined mainshaft. These trainies will take a ton of abuse in all actuality and you can upgrade the input shaft for some serious HP holding clutches. Not to mention you can pick a rebuild up for $1100 vs $3k+ for a 6spd. If the .75 OD isnt enough Hamilton Cams is making a larger OD gear in the .65 range (No affiliation to these guys, just good info to know). Dont sell them short. Issues rarely show up unless you are lugging 5th gear with a heavy load on a stock tranny or really abusing the trans sledpulling. Tons of trucks are making 500+ HP with upgraded cluthes.

 

The Dodge NV4500 will easily take 500 ftlbs of torque.

Its rated for 450 ft-lbs.... I would assume new venture engineers know more then we do about its torque capability.....and the last time I checked... 450 was less then 500.....

The transmission won't take 500 ft-lbs of torque.....if so it would have more then a 15,000 lb GVW rating(which is actually quite 'light').......contrairily its big brother the NV5600 can GVW up to 26,000 lbs..... (11,000 lbs is ALOT more weight)

The NV4500 was a good medium-light duty domestic 1-ton truck transmission.... no more.....no less.... (

Throw in a Torque King® mainshaft, and gear set.....4500HD (460 ft lbs) synch's.... and now your talking about getting some relabity out of a box........

If it was meant for heavier torque applications it would have cooling provisions in the cast housing itself..... of which all of the 5600, ZF650 etc units all have.....

If it came in a half ton... is it really a torque capable diesel motor monster?

 

I'm not saying the NV4500 is the end-all be-all transmission. However I don't understand why you keep trying to diminutize it. It's not a light transmission....... Ok, it was built for light trucks, but the heavier end of that spectrum, and was also installed in a medium duty or two. It may have been installed in some 1/2 tons, but it's not a lightweight 1/2 ton transmission. The transmission is capable of more than the rest of the truck in that case.

 

NV4500 evangelists sure get testy when you say anything bad about it

FWIW, I think a 4500 would be fine behind a 4bt with under a 15,000lb GCW. As long as the Torque King mainshaft is installed, that is. Only thing is, you are still going to have less desirable gear splits vs a 6 speed.

 

NV4500 evangelists sure get testy when you say anything bad about it

I know you know the NV4500 is a good strong transmission. I've read a few of your posts other places........ it seems you know manuals pretty well. Honestly, I've never driven an NV4500 that I can recall, but I know it's a very popluar swap when a heavy duty OD is needed/wanted. Usually with gas engines, but this is also the only diesel board I am a member of. One of these days I hope to get a truck with the NV4500, or if older, an SM465.

 

Fuller 4xxx series can be had with an SAE 3 housing. All the larger ones show SAE 2 only. You may want to check on this though - just because Eaton doesn't sell the heavier transmissions with an SAE 3 housing doesn't mean their SAE 3 housing won't bolt up to the larger transmissions.

 

For the money just go get a fully synchrod eaton fuller... parts are twice as cheap, and availability is easy... (along with the increased reliabiltiy of a transmission rated for 500-600 ft-lbs found in 30,000+ GVW trucks.....

And its a 6 speed which is something the OP wanted...........

 

Probably not a good idea in this case. The Eaton 6 speeds weigh about 400 lb or a little more and they only come with SAE #2 clutch housings. The original poster wanted something for #3. Might work with some sort of adapter but it's still a huge transmission for an f250.

 

Eaton lists the weight as 360lbs, which IIRC is what an Nv5600 weighs, and they were used in 3/4 ton Dodges. Likewise, the Allison 1000 weighs 330lbs and is used in 3/4 ton Chevies. If I were considering a 6 speed manual it would be at the top of my list - I'm willing to bet the SAE 3 housing will either bolt up, or can be adapted with a little work. A guy on one of the Dodge forums made an adapter to run a married transfer case as well

 

NV4500s are a fine transmission for what they are. For the arguements lets look at them this way.
-4500HD models came behind Dodge Cummins and V10s untill 2004 (03-04 std output commonrails). V10s were 500ftlb torque and the 12v Cummins were 440ftlb. I personnally put well over 440ftlbs through a 4500 for years. I killed a stock clutch and one that held over 15% power over stock. I switched to a 6spd when I needed a clutch that cost over $700. Trans is still in one piece with over 250k miles sitting in the barn collecting dust incase I sell the truck.
-4.3L chevies came in 3/4 trucks if you optioned it and NV4500 came in std duty 3/4 ton chevies. LD 3/4 tons (6 lug trucks) got the NV3500 trans. So it is very possibl to have a 4500 behind a 4.3L even though it is overkill.

 

Check the weight with a clutch housing, shifter, output yoke, and oil. I think it'll be a little over 400, it's a pretty good sized transmission.
I suppose you could adapt some other SAE #3 clutch housing to it, or use an adapter. Fuller does not make a #3 for that transmission, the FSO-6306A or FSO-8306A. Also need to figure out a clutch but I suspect that is manageable.

I seriously considered an FSO-6306A for my truck but when I found out they weigh as much or a tad more than the little 10 speed it was a pretty simple choice. The RTO-6610 is more bang for the buck, for my needs a better choice between the two.

Not that I need to, but I've seen a married transfer case on a small 10 speed, custom of course.
Grigg

 

Meh. You gotta figure that once a guy had decided to do a 6BT or 6BD1T swap the weight issue has pretty much gone out the window. What's an extra couple hundred pounds at that point, eh?

 

Is there an SAE3 to NV4500 bellhousing?

 

NV 4500 comes w/o bellhousing, use Chevy or Dodge mount pattern on engine.

 

Grigg, did you ever get good pics of the adapter for mating a transfer case to a 10 spd? I am getting close to doing a RTO-6613 to a 241DLD case in my dodge. I have a used yoke coming that can be cut up and finally sourced a mainshaft to butcher last week. Getting down to I need more time to play.

 

Nope, haven't seen that truck again..... Wouldn't do you any good any how, it was a 10 speed and you have a 13, back box is a completely different critter.

Grigg

 

Grigg. What is the differencebetween a 10 speed box and 13 spped? If I read it it right it is a twincounterhaft 660lb/ft tq 13 speed OD. Isn't it the same as a 10 but 3 more gears?

 

The main part of the transmission is the same yes, the 5 speed part.
The back box with the range is the difference.

Not that you couldent figure out an adapter, but it'll be different for the 13 speed.

Now consider this. That 13 speed weighs about 200 more pounds than the 10, and all you get out of it are 3 even lower gears. Because you'll have a transfer case you can get lower gears there, can you live without the 3 low ones in the 13 speed? Would make for a little more manageable package to use a 10 speed although still long and heavy with a transfer case on there.

Grigg